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e.w.
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 Posted: Thu Jun 26, 2008 12:45 am Post subject: Home LAN question |
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Hello, I have an issue that I need help resolving for a home LAN I am
planning.
My current router has only four wired ports, and they are all used. I
have the need for more ports, and was looking on Newegg at both
switches and hubs. Basically, I would like to know if I can piggyback
them together from one of the outputs (searching the net seems to
indicate that I can) to the input of the switch (or hub?). Also, the
Netgear switches I was looking at with eight ports have only the eight
ports labeled 1-8 but there is no "input" port as in an ordinary
router, so how would I go about wiring things up? The router I have
also handles the FiOS line, so I want to continue to use it.
Thanks in advance for any help.
Ernie |
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jameshanley39@yahoo.co.uk
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| Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 12:54 am Post subject: Re: Home LAN question |
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On Jun 26, 1:45 am, "e.w." <ew200...@gmail.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
Hello, I have an issue that I need help resolving for a home LAN I am
planning.
My current router has only four wired ports, and they are all used. I
have the need for more ports, and was looking on Newegg at both
switches and hubs. Basically, I would like to know if I can piggyback
them together from one of the outputs (searching the net seems to
indicate that I can) to the input of the switch (or hub?). Also, the
Netgear switches I was looking at with eight ports have only the eight
ports labeled 1-8 but there is no "input" port as in an ordinary
router, so how would I go about wiring things up? The router I have
also handles the FiOS line, so I want to continue to use it.
Thanks in advance for any help.
Ernie
|
why not just buy the switch and try things ?
there is a potential issue to do with needing a cross-over cable, or
one of the ports to be cross-over (aka uplink port I think). But you
can find that out soon enough if it doesn't work. You could buy a x-
over cable just incase, and you could buy a "crossover adaptor".
"cross over adaptor" or whatever you call them. see google images.
They effectively convert the straight through cable to cross-over .
I would bet that you won't have any straight through vs crossover
cable / port / adaptor issue though 'cos if your switch doesn't have
any "uplink port"(crossover port), then I would bet that it's
autosensing, so it will work.. And if your other device has an
uplink port then that's all you need. You only need one.
I may be wrong calling an uplink port a cross-over port.. But I get
the idea..
about like interfaces and unlike interfaces. And
computers and routers have unlike interfaces so a straight through
cable joins them. That kind of thing. And an "uplink port" is one port
whose interface is the other way. So a router can connect to a
router.
Tx=transmit
Rx=receive
1 pretend 2 wire cable
int1 int2
Tx------------------------------Rx
Rx-----------------------------Tx
see 2 interfaces/ports connected with a cable.
or call the intefaces the thing behind the ports maybe.
an ethernet cable has 8 wires.
Pre gigabit ethernet, 4 are unused.
So the 4 used as 2 twisted pairs. A cable connects 2 ports.
You don't want Tx-------------Tx which could happen if interfaces
are alike and you use a straight-through cable.
so you have cross-over cables . And you have devices with unlike
interfaces
straight through cables connected devices with unlike interfaces.
cross-over cables connect devices with like interfaces.
I am not sure particularly if there is a name for the type of ports
that Routers use compared to the type that computers use. They are
unlike.. But what specifically each is called. I am not sure.. Maybe
somebody knows. |
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GTS
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 1:04 am Post subject: Re: Home LAN question |
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Yes. Just connect any port on the switch to one of the LAN ports on your
router. (I usually use port 1 on a linked switch just as a convention.)
Most switches today are auto-sensing, meaning that they don't need a
separate uplink port or a cross over cable. They will automatically handle
the connection from the router.
--
"e.w." <ew200710@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:96e9ee11-d32e-4eb6-9696-bffdf6c75e39@t54g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
| Quote: |
Hello, I have an issue that I need help resolving for a home LAN I am
planning.
My current router has only four wired ports, and they are all used. I
have the need for more ports, and was looking on Newegg at both
switches and hubs. Basically, I would like to know if I can piggyback
them together from one of the outputs (searching the net seems to
indicate that I can) to the input of the switch (or hub?). Also, the
Netgear switches I was looking at with eight ports have only the eight
ports labeled 1-8 but there is no "input" port as in an ordinary
router, so how would I go about wiring things up? The router I have
also handles the FiOS line, so I want to continue to use it.
Thanks in advance for any help.
Ernie |
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caveat
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 11:01 am Post subject: Re: Home LAN question |
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"e.w." <ew200710@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:96e9ee11-d32e-4eb6-9696-bffdf6c75e39@t54g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
| Quote: |
Hello, I have an issue that I need help resolving for a home LAN I am
planning.
My current router has only four wired ports, and they are all used. I
have the need for more ports, and was looking on Newegg at both
switches and hubs. Basically, I would like to know if I can piggyback
them together from one of the outputs (searching the net seems to
indicate that I can) to the input of the switch (or hub?). Also, the
Netgear switches I was looking at with eight ports have only the eight
ports labeled 1-8 but there is no "input" port as in an ordinary
router, so how would I go about wiring things up? The router I have
also handles the FiOS line, so I want to continue to use it.
Thanks in advance for any help.
Ernie
|
You can connect any port of the router to any port of the switch. However,
depending on which router and/or switch you use you may need a cross-over
cable. I'm not sure how the gigabit cables are wired but with 100 megabit
Ethernet cables the cross-over is done by swapping the orange and green
pairs. Most modern routers and switches or hubs can auto-detect the need for
cross-over or they have a switch that you can trip to make one port a
cross-over port.
The difference between a switch and a hub is that a hub shares all its lines
so only two devices can communicate through a hub at a time. This is where
CSMA/CD (you can google it) comes into play.
With a switch, the two communicating devices have an exclusive communication
path and the other ports in the switch are free to be used by other devices.
If you are simply connecting the computers together for internet access then
you probably won't notice much speed difference between a hub vs. a switch
since the internet access will be shared in both situations and the access
speed of the internet connection is usually the greatest bottleneck.
If however, you are sending a lot of files between computers then you would
probably notice an advantage with a switch.
As far as how to wire it, you are better off putting all the computers that
need to communicate with each other on the same switch. This way they can
set up an unobstructed communication path between each other. Other wise, if
computer (A) on the router wants to communicate with computer (B) on the
connected switch while computer (C) on the switch wants to use the internet
then computer (B) and (C) are both trying to communicate over the link
cable.
This is usually not much of a problem with a small home network but it is
something to think about for large networks or networks that do a lot of
talking with each other at the same time.
As far as FiOS, I think it is a higher level protocol than Physical or Data
Link, so it should be OK through any hub or switch. Not sure about that
though since I know almost nothing about FiOS.
Chris |
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jameshanley39@yahoo.co.uk
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| Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 1:41 pm Post subject: Re: Home LAN question |
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On Jun 27, 1:54 am, "jameshanle...@yahoo.co.uk"
<jameshanle...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
| Quote: |
On Jun 26, 1:45 am, "e.w." <ew200...@gmail.com> wrote:
snip |
I asked if there was a name for the ports that are one way and the
ones that are another way.
Here are the names and which is which
Conclusion from all this is essentially this
H=hub, S=switch C=computer R=router
MDI MDIX
C H
R S
but since home routers with modem contain a switch, they prob connect
with a straight through cable.
and the ports are autosensing anyway.
so they'd prob connect with a crossover too.
I don't know whether home routers without modem. Whether they use a
switch or not. No doubt they have autosensing too anyway.
The above table did come from cisco people, so I don't kow if it is
cisco specific. Certainly though C/the NI in a comp, uses MDI.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Which devices are MDI and which are MDIX?
[
Computers (The NI-network interface (NIC or embedded on MBRD NI) are
MDI).
I have thought
Routers would be MDIX ('cos they must be the opposite since they
connect to computers with a straight-through). My use of "home routers
with modems"
But with autosensing one wouldn't know, and those types of home router
have a switch built in. So my experience or tests there are not much
good.
From this table, it seems that routers are MDI
http://www.sadikhov.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=46523
http://www.sadikhov.com/forum/lofiversion/index.php?t48754.html
Notice from this table. of Hub,switch,router,workstation
Hubs and Switches are in the same bag. i.e. LIKE devices. (look
horizontally or vertically at H,S, they are the same. similarly with
R,W)
Routers and workstations are in the same bag , i.e. LIKE devices
one can see W and R, are connected with a crossover, so they must be
alike.
H and S are connected with t so they must be unlike.
And it's obvious that connecting the same thing like w-w s-s r-r h-h
needs a crossover.
t=straight through
x=crossover
H S R W
H x x t t
S x x t t
R t t x x
W t t x x
(so saying that devices are connected with a crossover would be
untrue. *Like* devices are connected with a crossover though!).
though nowadays, every port is MDI/MDIX i.e. autosenses
so wherever this 1 uplink port was, I think it no longer exists
So
MDI MDIX
W
we know that from wikipedia about an MDI port.
We can add to that list
MDI MDIX
W H
R S
workstation/computer.
change W to C.
MDI MDIX
C H
R S
computer rhymes with router.
hubs/switches <-- very similar .
somebody on one of the links wrote that there is some relationship
between OSI layer and this, but that is false. He from what he wrote
had never used a hub!
Hubs and switches are of course different OSI layers
]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MDI_port
A medium dependent interface (MDI) port or an uplink port is an
Ethernet port connection typically used on the Network Interface Card
(NIC) or Integrated NIC port on a PC
[is it still called an uplink port on other MDIX devices?]
http://www.webopedia.com/TERM/M/MDIX.htm
Short for medium dependent interface crossover (the “X” representing
“crossover”), an Ethernet port connection that allows networked end
stations (i.e., PCs or workstations) to connect to each other using a
null-modem, or crossover, cable.
Compare with MDI.
MDIX=MDIX port (MDIX is also referred to as MDIX port)
http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:qYFpUlC7rQYJ:searchnetworking.techtarget.com/sDefinition/0,,sid7_gci786996,00.html+MDI+MDIX+Ethernet&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=4
"
- MDI/MDIX is a type of Ethernet port connection using twisted pair
cabling. The MDI (for medium dependent interface) is the component of
the media attachment unit (MAU) that provides the physical and
electrical connection to the cabling medium.
An MDIX (for MDI crossover) is a version of MDI that enables
connection between like devices.
[the above sentence is overly confusing and odd, I would ignore it]
MDI ports connect to MDIX ports via straight-through twisted pair
cabling; both MDI-to-MDI and MDIX-to-MDIX connections use crossover
twisted pair cabling.
" |
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jameshanley39@yahoo.co.uk
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 2:58 pm Post subject: Re: Home LAN question |
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On Jun 27, 3:54 pm, Steve Meyerson <stevemeyer...@verizon.net> wrote:
| Quote: |
On Wed, 25 Jun 2008 17:45:18 -0700 (PDT), "e.w." <ew200...@gmail.com
wrote:
Hello, I have an issue that I need help resolving for a home LAN I am
planning.
My current router has only four wired ports, and they are all used. I
have the need for more ports, and was looking on Newegg at both
switches and hubs. Basically, I wouldliketo know if I can piggyback
them together from one of the outputs (searching the net seems to
indicate that I can) to the input of the switch (or hub?). Also, the
Netgear switches I was looking at with eight ports have only the eight
ports labeled 1-8 but there is no "input" port as in an ordinary
router, so how would I go about wiring things up? The router I have
also handles the FiOS line, so I want to continue to use it.
Thanks in advance for any help.
Ernie
You got some good answers. Here's my 2 cents.
My Linksys 5-port switch has an input (6th) port labeled "Uplink". The
switch was inexpensive (don't remember exactly how much it cost).
Model is EZXS55W 10/100 5-port Workgroup Switch.
All I did was run a cable from one of my 4-port router's output port
to the switch's Uplink port and it works as if I had a 9-port router
(as far as I can tell - someone may prove me wrong on this). Actually
I have a computer and a network printer attached to the switch.
Steve-
|
I think that if your router ports are really router ports then you
would be able to give each its own subnet.
And you cannot do that with switch ports.
The question then would be whether the thing you call a router, has
switch ports or router ports. What make/model is it?
Maybe somebody knows which it has..
it would be interesting.. |
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- Bobb -
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 6:39 pm Post subject: Re: Home LAN question |
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"caveat" <caveat-lector@cox.net> wrote in message
news:sp%8k.5137$xb2.2677@newsfe12.phx...
| Quote: |
"e.w." <ew200710@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:96e9ee11-d32e-4eb6-9696-bffdf6c75e39@t54g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
Hello, I have an issue that I need help resolving for a home LAN I am
planning.
My current router has only four wired ports, and they are all used. I
have the need for more ports, and was looking on Newegg at both
switches and hubs. Basically, I would like to know if I can piggyback
them together from one of the outputs (searching the net seems to
indicate that I can) to the input of the switch (or hub?). Also, the
Netgear switches I was looking at with eight ports have only the eight
ports labeled 1-8 but there is no "input" port as in an ordinary
router, so how would I go about wiring things up? The router I have
also handles the FiOS line, so I want to continue to use it.
Thanks in advance for any help.
Ernie
|
Here's a walk-through by Dan Bricklin of FIOS at his house.
http://www.bricklin.com/fiosinstall.htm
( Ok who remembers - before Excel - before Lotus 1-2-3 , before the
original IBM PC - there was VisiCalc. He's the guy who wrote VisiCalc -
which made the Apple II not a hobbyist toy, but a useful business
computer. The rest is history.)
I tried:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=fios+router+switch+wiring
and see that for FIOS, Verizon needs to "turn on ONT", so read a few of
those posts, like"
http://www.broadbandreports.com/forum/r20154935-Verizon-Fios-ONT-Enabling-CAT5-Connection-Help
Seems like if you take Verizon account default install, it won't work ???
I don't have Verizon - just from reading these, it seems like you need to
ASK for ONT during install. |
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jameshanley39@yahoo.co.uk
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 7:05 pm Post subject: Re: Home LAN question |
|
|
On Jun 27, 6:07 pm, Steve Meyerson <stevemeyer...@verizon.net> wrote:
| Quote: |
On Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:58:28 -0700 (PDT), "jameshanle...@yahoo.co.uk"
jameshanle...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
On Jun 27, 3:54 pm, Steve Meyerson <stevemeyer...@verizon.net> wrote:
On Wed, 25 Jun 2008 17:45:18 -0700 (PDT), "e.w." <ew200...@gmail.com
wrote:
Hello, I have an issue that I need help resolving for a home LAN I am
planning.
My current router has only four wired ports, and they are all used. I
have the need for more ports, and was looking on Newegg at both
switches and hubs. Basically, I wouldliketo know if I can piggyback
them together from one of the outputs (searching the net seems to
indicate that I can) to the input of the switch (or hub?). Also, the
Netgear switches I was looking at with eight ports have only the eight
ports labeled 1-8 but there is no "input" port as in an ordinary
router, so how would I go about wiring things up? The router I have
also handles the FiOS line, so I want to continue to use it.
Thanks in advance for any help.
Ernie
You got some good answers. Here's my 2 cents.
My Linksys 5-port switch has an input (6th) port labeled "Uplink". The
switch was inexpensive (don't remember exactly how much it cost).
Model is EZXS55W 10/100 5-port Workgroup Switch.
All I did was run a cable from one of my 4-port router's output port
to the switch's Uplink port and it works as if I had a 9-port router
(as far as I can tell - someone may prove me wrong on this). Actually
I have a computer and a network printer attached to the switch.
Steve-
I think that if your router ports are really router ports then you
would be able to give each its own subnet.
And you cannot do that with switch ports.
The question then would be whether the thing you call a router, has
switch ports or router ports. What make/model is it?
Maybe somebody knows which it has..
it would be interesting..
It's a Linksys Broadband Router with 2 phone ports - Model RTP300. (I
use the phone ports for my 2 Vonage lines).
Steve-
|
I see a manual here
http://www.vonage.com/help.php?article=936&category=90&nav=3
I see it is of the type.. Router without modem. So, it has an
ethernet port for one to connect it to a modem. These often have more
advanced router features.. I have always been unsure whether these
ones are real routers / have real router ports.
the truth is out there! anybody?
note- for others.. Looking at the manual..this model does have
telephone sockets, RJ11 sockets. but in this case, not because it has
a modem.. Not for connecting to the wall. Not a modem in the typical
sense anyway. The RJ11 sockets are for connecting a telephone to. I
may be wrong there, my knowledge of voip and modems are limited.
I see , checking ebay for a wired router without modem, did router -
dsl -wireless, I got
BEFSR41
It's advertised as a cable/dsl router. The fact that it says cable/
dsl means neither really. Any modem is not included and is connected
externally. So it's like your router in that sense. Typically this
type of router has more advanced features.. And perhaps not a switch.
The manual for that one says it has a switch , very early on, in the
features.
Your one.. I don't see any router like features in your one.. anything
more than the router/switches I have. And when it refers to subnet
mask, it refers to it as for the whole thing. So it is not on a per
port basis. So this is most probably switch ports.
And it says
"
Ethernet 1-4 These four Ethernet ports connect to network devices,
such as PCs or more switches.
"
The fact that it says "more switches" implies that there is already a
switch.. Which could only be that..
So, I think it has a switch.
So, you would be more correct in saying that you "router, has a 4
port switch built in(+ 1 switch port - the uplink port), and so
connecting a 5 port switch to that uplink port, makes it like a 9
port switch.
Connecting 2 of the same type of device together, like 2 switches.
Requires either that you have one interface reversed i.e. what the
uplink port is for.
Or, you have both interfaces the same and use a crossover cable.
So you could also connect your switch to one of the regular ports on
your "linksys RT300 router/switch". But using a crossover cable.
This is to ensure that the transmit(Tx) connects to the receive(Rx).
Since if 2 interfaces are alike and you connect them with a straight-
through cable, you get a clash. Hence the 2 possible solutions
- crossover cable
- uplink port
or a third solution, using an adaptor to make a straight through cable
like a crossover cable.
And if your 5 port switch has no uplink port, then maybe it's
autosensing, and you could connect it to one of the regular ports on
your router/switch and it will still work.
And when I say router/switch, I mean the linksys RT300, which has many
things in it. It has a router in it with only 2 arms, (so not much of
a decision to make when it receives something at one end.. it only
really needs to pass it to the other end!). On the LAN end, it is
connected to a switch - which you see. So when you connect something
to the RT300's regular ports or uplink port, you are connecting it to
a switch. But I suppose the WAN port it has, that is a port of the
router itself. (the switch is only on the LAN end) |
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Steve Meyerson
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 7:54 pm Post subject: Re: Home LAN question |
|
|
On Wed, 25 Jun 2008 17:45:18 -0700 (PDT), "e.w." <ew200710@gmail.com>
wrote:
| Quote: |
Hello, I have an issue that I need help resolving for a home LAN I am
planning.
My current router has only four wired ports, and they are all used. I
have the need for more ports, and was looking on Newegg at both
switches and hubs. Basically, I would like to know if I can piggyback
them together from one of the outputs (searching the net seems to
indicate that I can) to the input of the switch (or hub?). Also, the
Netgear switches I was looking at with eight ports have only the eight
ports labeled 1-8 but there is no "input" port as in an ordinary
router, so how would I go about wiring things up? The router I have
also handles the FiOS line, so I want to continue to use it.
Thanks in advance for any help.
Ernie
|
You got some good answers. Here's my 2 cents.
My Linksys 5-port switch has an input (6th) port labeled "Uplink". The
switch was inexpensive (don't remember exactly how much it cost).
Model is EZXS55W 10/100 5-port Workgroup Switch.
All I did was run a cable from one of my 4-port router's output port
to the switch's Uplink port and it works as if I had a 9-port router
(as far as I can tell - someone may prove me wrong on this). Actually
I have a computer and a network printer attached to the switch.
Steve |
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Steve Meyerson
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 10:07 pm Post subject: Re: Home LAN question |
|
|
On Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:58:28 -0700 (PDT), "jameshanley39@yahoo.co.uk"
<jameshanley39@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
| Quote: |
On Jun 27, 3:54 pm, Steve Meyerson <stevemeyer...@verizon.net> wrote:
On Wed, 25 Jun 2008 17:45:18 -0700 (PDT), "e.w." <ew200...@gmail.com
wrote:
Hello, I have an issue that I need help resolving for a home LAN I am
planning.
My current router has only four wired ports, and they are all used. I
have the need for more ports, and was looking on Newegg at both
switches and hubs. Basically, I wouldliketo know if I can piggyback
them together from one of the outputs (searching the net seems to
indicate that I can) to the input of the switch (or hub?). Also, the
Netgear switches I was looking at with eight ports have only the eight
ports labeled 1-8 but there is no "input" port as in an ordinary
router, so how would I go about wiring things up? The router I have
also handles the FiOS line, so I want to continue to use it.
Thanks in advance for any help.
Ernie
You got some good answers. Here's my 2 cents.
My Linksys 5-port switch has an input (6th) port labeled "Uplink". The
switch was inexpensive (don't remember exactly how much it cost).
Model is EZXS55W 10/100 5-port Workgroup Switch.
All I did was run a cable from one of my 4-port router's output port
to the switch's Uplink port and it works as if I had a 9-port router
(as far as I can tell - someone may prove me wrong on this). Actually
I have a computer and a network printer attached to the switch.
Steve-
I think that if your router ports are really router ports then you
would be able to give each its own subnet.
And you cannot do that with switch ports.
The question then would be whether the thing you call a router, has
switch ports or router ports. What make/model is it?
Maybe somebody knows which it has..
it would be interesting..
|
It's a Linksys Broadband Router with 2 phone ports - Model RTP300. (I
use the phone ports for my 2 Vonage lines).
Steve |
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caveat
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 9:30 am Post subject: Re: Home LAN question |
|
|
"- Bobb -" <bobb@noemail.123> wrote in message
news:K5idnSQH054QcPnVnZ2dnUVZ_sOdnZ2d@comcast.com...
| Quote: |
"caveat" <caveat-lector@cox.net> wrote in message
news:sp%8k.5137$xb2.2677@newsfe12.phx...
"e.w." <ew200710@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:96e9ee11-d32e-4eb6-9696-bffdf6c75e39@t54g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
Hello, I have an issue that I need help resolving for a home LAN I am
planning.
My current router has only four wired ports, and they are all used. I
have the need for more ports, and was looking on Newegg at both
switches and hubs. Basically, I would like to know if I can piggyback
them together from one of the outputs (searching the net seems to
indicate that I can) to the input of the switch (or hub?). Also, the
Netgear switches I was looking at with eight ports have only the eight
ports labeled 1-8 but there is no "input" port as in an ordinary
router, so how would I go about wiring things up? The router I have
also handles the FiOS line, so I want to continue to use it.
Thanks in advance for any help.
Ernie
Here's a walk-through by Dan Bricklin of FIOS at his house.
http://www.bricklin.com/fiosinstall.htm
( Ok who remembers - before Excel - before Lotus 1-2-3 , before the
original IBM PC - there was VisiCalc. He's the guy who wrote VisiCalc -
which made the Apple II not a hobbyist toy, but a useful business
computer. The rest is history.)
I tried:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=fios+router+switch+wiring
and see that for FIOS, Verizon needs to "turn on ONT", so read a few of
those posts, like"
http://www.broadbandreports.com/forum/r20154935-Verizon-Fios-ONT-Enabling-CAT5-Connection-Help
Seems like if you take Verizon account default install, it won't work ???
I don't have Verizon - just from reading these, it seems like you need to
ASK for ONT during install.
|
OK, it looks like FIOS is a fiber technology - I learned something new.
Thanks |
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Steve Meyerson
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 5:28 pm Post subject: Re: Home LAN question |
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On Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:05:02 -0700 (PDT), "jameshanley39@yahoo.co.uk"
<jameshanley39@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
| Quote: |
On Jun 27, 6:07 pm, Steve Meyerson <stevemeyer...@verizon.net> wrote:
On Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:58:28 -0700 (PDT), "jameshanle...@yahoo.co.uk"
jameshanle...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
On Jun 27, 3:54 pm, Steve Meyerson <stevemeyer...@verizon.net> wrote:
On Wed, 25 Jun 2008 17:45:18 -0700 (PDT), "e.w." <ew200...@gmail.com
wrote:
Hello, I have an issue that I need help resolving for a home LAN I am
planning.
My current router has only four wired ports, and they are all used. I
have the need for more ports, and was looking on Newegg at both
switches and hubs. Basically, I wouldliketo know if I can piggyback
them together from one of the outputs (searching the net seems to
indicate that I can) to the input of the switch (or hub?). Also, the
Netgear switches I was looking at with eight ports have only the eight
ports labeled 1-8 but there is no "input" port as in an ordinary
router, so how would I go about wiring things up? The router I have
also handles the FiOS line, so I want to continue to use it.
Thanks in advance for any help.
Ernie
You got some good answers. Here's my 2 cents.
My Linksys 5-port switch has an input (6th) port labeled "Uplink". The
switch was inexpensive (don't remember exactly how much it cost).
Model is EZXS55W 10/100 5-port Workgroup Switch.
All I did was run a cable from one of my 4-port router's output port
to the switch's Uplink port and it works as if I had a 9-port router
(as far as I can tell - someone may prove me wrong on this). Actually
I have a computer and a network printer attached to the switch.
Steve-
I think that if your router ports are really router ports then you
would be able to give each its own subnet.
And you cannot do that with switch ports.
The question then would be whether the thing you call a router, has
switch ports or router ports. What make/model is it?
Maybe somebody knows which it has..
it would be interesting..
It's a Linksys Broadband Router with 2 phone ports - Model RTP300. (I
use the phone ports for my 2 Vonage lines).
Steve-
I see a manual here
http://www.vonage.com/help.php?article=936&category=90&nav=3
I see it is of the type.. Router without modem. So, it has an
ethernet port for one to connect it to a modem. These often have more
advanced router features.. I have always been unsure whether these
ones are real routers / have real router ports.
the truth is out there! anybody?
note- for others.. Looking at the manual..this model does have
telephone sockets, RJ11 sockets. but in this case, not because it has
a modem.. Not for connecting to the wall. Not a modem in the typical
sense anyway. The RJ11 sockets are for connecting a telephone to. I
may be wrong there, my knowledge of voip and modems are limited.
|
You're correct in that the line into the RJ11 socket goes to the phone
itself, not the wall. Actually, I do use the in-house wiring, but only
to connect 3 phone extensions to my system (after disconnecting the
landline phone company's voltage from the house).
| Quote: |
I see , checking ebay for a wired router without modem, did router -
dsl -wireless, I got
BEFSR41
It's advertised as a cable/dsl router. The fact that it says cable/
dsl means neither really. Any modem is not included and is connected
externally. So it's like your router in that sense. Typically this
type of router has more advanced features.. And perhaps not a switch.
The manual for that one says it has a switch , very early on, in the
features.
|
I used a BEFSR41, but had to "switch" because it had no RJ11 socket.
Vonage supplied the RTP300 ($??) when I signed up with them 2 yrs ago.
Note: I've been very satisfied with Vonage, but Verizon switched me to
a fancy ActionTec router (free, I think) when I signed up for their
FIOS. It conked out 7 days after the 1-yr warranty expired, so I
switched back to the RTP300 and it appears to handle FIOS fine.
| Quote: |
Your one.. I don't see any router like features in your one.. anything
more than the router/switches I have. And when it refers to subnet
mask, it refers to it as for the whole thing. So it is not on a per
port basis. So this is most probably switch ports.
And it says
"
Ethernet 1-4 These four Ethernet ports connect to network devices,
such as PCs or more switches.
"
The fact that it says "more switches" implies that there is already a
switch.. Which could only be that..
So, I think it has a switch.
So, you would be more correct in saying that you "router, has a 4
port switch built in(+ 1 switch port - the uplink port), and so
connecting a 5 port switch to that uplink port, makes it like a 9
port switch.
Connecting 2 of the same type of device together, like 2 switches.
Requires either that you have one interface reversed i.e. what the
uplink port is for.
Or, you have both interfaces the same and use a crossover cable.
So you could also connect your switch to one of the regular ports on
your "linksys RT300 router/switch". But using a crossover cable.
This is to ensure that the transmit(Tx) connects to the receive(Rx).
|
I think the cable I used is a regular (not crossover) cable, so I
guess one of the "interfaces" must be reversed. ?
| Quote: |
Since if 2 interfaces are alike and you connect them with a straight-
through cable, you get a clash. Hence the 2 possible solutions
- crossover cable
- uplink port
or a third solution, using an adaptor to make a straight through cable
like a crossover cable.
And if your 5 port switch has no uplink port, then maybe it's
autosensing, and you could connect it to one of the regular ports on
your router/switch and it will still work.
And when I say router/switch, I mean the linksys RT300, which has many
things in it. It has a router in it with only 2 arms, (so not much of
a decision to make when it receives something at one end.. it only
really needs to pass it to the other end!). On the LAN end, it is
connected to a switch - which you see. So when you connect something
to the RT300's regular ports or uplink port, you are connecting it to
a switch. But I suppose the WAN port it has, that is a port of the
router itself. (the switch is only on the LAN end)
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jameshanley39@yahoo.co.uk
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 10:19 pm Post subject: Re: Home LAN question |
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On Jun 28, 1:28 pm, Steve Meyerson <stevemeyer...@verizon.net> wrote:
| Quote: |
On Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:05:02 -0700 (PDT), "jameshanle...@yahoo.co.uk"
snip
note- for others.. Looking at the manual..this model does have
telephone sockets, RJ11 sockets. but in this case, not because it has
a modem.. Not for connecting to the wall. Not a modem in the typical
sense anyway. The RJ11 sockets are for connecting a telephone to. I
may be wrong there, my knowledge of voip and modems are limited.
You're correct in that the line into the RJ11 socket goes to the phone
itself, not the wall. Actually, I do use the in-house wiring, but only
to connect 3 phone extensions to my system (after disconnecting the
landline phone company's voltage from the house).
|
interesting.., when you say you use the in-house wiring, do you mean
you plug it to the wall? I guess that makes sense, number dialling
done by the telephone, and internet connection going out elsewhere -
in this case through your connected modem, and through the wall.
| Quote: |
I see , checking ebay for a wired router without modem, did router -
dsl -wireless, I got
BEFSR41
It's advertised as a cable/dsl router. The fact that it says cable/
dsl means neither really. Any modem is not included and is connected
externally. So it's like your router in that sense. Typically this
type of router has more advanced features.. And perhaps not a switch.
The manual for that one says it has a switch , very early on, in the
features.
I used a BEFSR41, but had to "switch" because it had no RJ11 socket.
Vonage supplied the RTP300 ($??) when I signed up with them 2 yrs ago.
Note: I've been very satisfied with Vonage, but Verizon switched me to
a fancy ActionTec router (free, I think) when I signed up for their
FIOS. It conked out 7 days after the 1-yr warranty expired, so I
switched back to the RTP300 and it appears to handle FIOS fine.
|
you prob know this already, but
always check the heat. (can see how hot a router/modem is getting,
with your hand)
don't run a router/modem on a carpet. Especially, check for any
holes, you don't want them on the carpet. Wooden surface is best. And
holes up. I have a router upside down (because holes are on the
bottom!), and I put it on a wooden floor.
laptops also, good to run on wooden surface. Big no no to run them on
carpet or bed. one could probably see the cpu temp rise in BIOS or
with software if one does that.
<snip>
| Quote: |
Connecting 2 of the same type of device together, like 2 switches.
Requires either that you have one interface reversed i.e. what the
uplink port is for.
Or, you have both interfaces the same and use a crossover cable.
So you could also connect your switch to one of the regular ports on
your "linksys RT300 router/switch". But using a crossover cable.
This is to ensure that the transmit(Tx) connects to the receive(Rx).
I think the cable I used is a regular (not crossover) cable, so I
guess one of the "interfaces" must be reversed. ?
|
in any pair of ports connected by a straight-through cable, if it
works then it has to be that one port is the reverse of the other.
Your RT300 is a switch where you plug the cable in. Its ports are
"like" the ports of your 5 port switch. You use your uplink port on
your RT300. That is so-called because it is the "reverse" of the other
ports on it. It's the other type. (I don't know why they call it
uplink, but it is the reverse of the other ports)
To be specific. The port/interface orientations have names.
A computer/router uses MDI, A switch/hub uses MDIX.
You have no router ports.
Did you say you connect your 5 port switch to your RT300 using the
uplink port on your RT300 ?
Would it fail if you used a regular port on your RT300?
That would prove that your RT300 is a switch on the outside. So uses
MDIX like your 5 port switch. And so the uplink port on your RT300
(Which is MDI. uplink is reverse of other ports ) that allows it to
connect to another switch - your 5 port switch , whose ports are all
MDIX.
If though, you found that it worked regardless of which port you
connect to which port. Then one or both devices are using autosensing
of MDI/MDIX. So any "reversing" is done in some kind of clever
electronics hack or logic. |
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Steve Meyerson
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| Posted: Sun Jun 29, 2008 8:39 am Post subject: Re: Home LAN question |
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On Sat, 28 Jun 2008 15:19:03 -0700 (PDT), "jameshanley39@yahoo.co.uk"
<jameshanley39@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
| Quote: |
interesting.., when you say you use the in-house wiring, do you mean
you plug it to the wall? I guess that makes sense, number dialling
done by the telephone, and internet connection going out elsewhere -
in this case through your connected modem, and through the wall.
|
Yes, that's pretty much it. The phone wire goes from my router at one
end of the house to the main base of my cordless phone, which is at
the other end of the house. I use the house's internal phone wiring
only to make that connection, so the phone's physical connection to
the router actually goes into and through the wall. If you do this,
it's important to disconnect the phone company's wiring at the box
just outside the house. Otherwise (they say) the voltage will blow out
the router. I haven't (and won't) verify that:)
| Quote: |
always check the heat. (can see how hot a router/modem is getting,
with your hand)
don't run a router/modem on a carpet. Especially, check for any
holes, you don't want them on the carpet. Wooden surface is best. And
holes up. I have a router upside down (because holes are on the
bottom!), and I put it on a wooden floor.
laptops also, good to run on wooden surface. Big no no to run them on
carpet or bed. one could probably see the cpu temp rise in BIOS or
with software if one does that.
|
Interesting.
| Quote: |
Did you say you connect your 5 port switch to your RT300 using the
uplink port on your RT300 ?
|
No, it's connected to one of the other 4 (or 6 if you include the RJ11
"ports"). My uplink port is connected to the broadband cable from
FIOS. As you may know, FIOS is optic fiber only TO the house. Verizon
installs a converter outside (or just inside) the house. From there,
it's Cat 5 cable to the router.
An aside: I may drop FIOS. I can't say FIOS is any faster than my
previous Cox broadband. Also, I'm really ticked at Verizon for
eliminating most newsgroups (including this one) from their server. I
am now paying $2.95/mo to read and post on another server (Usenet
Monster).
| Quote: |
Would it fail if you used a regular port on your RT300?
That would prove that your RT300 is a switch on the outside. So uses
MDIX like your 5 port switch. And so the uplink port on your RT300
(Which is MDI. uplink is reverse of other ports ) that allows it to
connect to another switch - your 5 port switch , whose ports are all
MDIX.
If though, you found that it worked regardless of which port you
connect to which port. Then one or both devices are using autosensing
of MDI/MDIX. So any "reversing" is done in some kind of clever
electronics hack or logic.
|
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JANA
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jun 30, 2008 8:05 am Post subject: Re: Home LAN question |
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I have a router feeding a 10 port switch. This resolved the issue for me
to add a number of computers on to the router.
--
JANA
_____
"e.w." <ew200710@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:96e9ee11-d32e-4eb6-9696-bffdf6c75e39@t54g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
Hello, I have an issue that I need help resolving for a home LAN I am
planning.
My current router has only four wired ports, and they are all used. I
have the need for more ports, and was looking on Newegg at both
switches and hubs. Basically, I would like to know if I can piggyback
them together from one of the outputs (searching the net seems to
indicate that I can) to the input of the switch (or hub?). Also, the
Netgear switches I was looking at with eight ports have only the eight
ports labeled 1-8 but there is no "input" port as in an ordinary
router, so how would I go about wiring things up? The router I have
also handles the FiOS line, so I want to continue to use it.
Thanks in advance for any help.
Ernie |
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